From: John Gray
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:16:10 +0100
Subject: [imps] Lead replacement additives
Hi everyone out there who keeps up such an interesting exchange of views and information.
My introductory question to the group is to ask whether anyone has located Millers VSP, which is the additive recommended for Imps following the independent trials.
I have tried Halfords and a couple of accessory shops, and been offered other makes.
I would like to start using Millers VSP, partly to reduce my lead consumption, and partly because a number of garages are only offering LRP 4 star, which I understand from the Impressions coverage is not suitable.
Incidentally, I have been surprised that LRP is being offered as a straight substitute, and no real effort is being made to persuade people to convert other cars to unleaded, even though a large number apparently could be.
I suppose the perception is that 4 star/LRP provides more power and so is worth the extra cost, but surely unleaded is environmentally better.
From: "John Rhodes" Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 07:32:46 +1000
From: Anthony Goodall
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:37:40 +0100 (BST)
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:40:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Nickcleak@aol.com
From: Richard Murtha
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:30:25 +0100
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
I live only a few miles away from the factory and recently enquired about costs of their oils for someone else who asked your question previously.
They will sell you it at some slight discount if you go to their counter, a better price can be had from Imp enthusiasts on this line but I don't remember who.
If you get no useful contacts from others who read this mail then tell me and I'll get you the address, or look it up in yellow pages or directory enquiries. Millers Oils, Brighouse, West Yorks. You can then ask them direct for the address of a local retailer.
Can someone confirm that Millers oil is for putting into green petrol not LRP, the savings are therefore greater as the 'LR' bit is not required?
John (Hear that echo. John?)
Another thing, judging by the friendly rivalry which apprears to exist between Imp and M**i owners, (we apparently appreciate their enthusiasm but pity the lack of channelling it in a sensible direction), you really should plug into some of the watercooled VW sites for a laugh. What a world apart they can be! Rather akin to the CB radio stuff I gave up before starting secondary school. There's a whole new vocabulary to be learned out there, little of it complimentary, thank goodness for this site and it's respondents.
From: Mike Marsh
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
>but surely unleaded is environmentally better.
Laudable intent John, but actually not. The entire leaded petrol debacle is one of the classic Urban Legends of all time. The real reasons for introduction of unleaded have nothing to do with scientific analysis of environmental risk/benefit ratio.
I guess its pretty much topical for all lovers of old cars of any type... but rather than fill the list with detail I'll refer those interested to Darcy's informative summary of the subject - try http://www.petrie.starway.net.au/~darcy/unleaded.htm
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:05:14 +0100
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
I have been following the unleaded debate from the beginning and Mike is
right.
Unleaded petrol was first introduced in California in the mid seventies so that catalytic converters could be fitted to cars to help reduce the smog problem in Los Angeles. I was in California in 1982 and unleaded was available from all filling stations, although people with older cars still bought leaded. By about 1988 there was no leaded available at all!
Unleaded (and also LRP) is actually more dangerous than four star because it contains carcinogenic additives to bring the octane rating back up, so don't get it on your skin! The lead in four star is not particularly dangerous in itself, it comes out of the exhaust as tiny metallic pellets which fall onto the road. It is not possible to breathe in the lead. The only logical reason for banning it is to get us all to buy new cars with cats, which the government wants because it increases the profits of the motor industry and makes our air cleaner (as required by the Kyoto accord) at no cost to them.
See the Association of British Drivers website at www.abd.org.uk for more information.
Don't use Millers with LRP. Millers contains manganese, whereas LRP contains potassium, engine damage results (apparently) if you mix the two. The only additive using potassium is Superblend, which is a bit cheaper than Millers but doesn't contain any octane booster.
Personally, I am going to use LRP and keep checking the valve clearances; when (if) they start closing up drastically then I shall get hardened valve seats fitted.
From: Steve Brindle
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
One of the reasons that leaded pertol has been phased
out in this county is that the royal commision for the environment reconmended it to the government in a lead reduction document. This did specify that further work on replacemnet/alt fuels should take place first.
It has been shown that since lead content was reduced from 4mg L to 1.5 mgL that atmospheric lead levels in the UK have reduced. However this doesn't corelate with lead levels in humans over this time, which have shown no significant loss. the main reason for phasing leaded out was so we can all use cats (for environmental reasons). Unfortunatly with no development on fuels we now only have a choise of unleaded with much larger benzene content, which without dought will cause have. Cats are a daft idea anyway because manufacturers have no choice but to fit them, even though they make the car less fuel efficient and don't really work in britain. (all the testing was done in the usa).
many manufacturers could make cars with lower emmisions than a cat equiped car but there is no economic gain in doing so cos they cannot sell them.
also if you want to swap from dynamo to alternator cheeply go down the mini scrap yard and get a second hand one should cost ten squid max!
i always get starters from such places for £5
From: Si Trickett
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
Millers VSP is availible from Motorist Discount Centres
well in Dorset anyhow
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:54:43 EDT
Subject: Re: [imps] Lead replacement additives
In a message dated 19/10/99 13:16:13 GMT Daylight Time, john_gray@edl.uk.com
writes:
> I suppose the perception is that 4 star/LRP provides more power and so is
> worth the extra cost, but surely unleaded is environmentally better.
well from my experience the unleaded has just as much , if not more power
potential in the imp than 4 star
remember it's not the old 2 star we may think it is ..
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:30:47 +0100
Subject: [imps] Millers VSP
Yes of course the phasing out of leaded is a political cock-up, largely generated by American pressure as suggested - but i guess we are stuck with it.
I can supply Millers VSP to anyone who wants it for £2.70 a bottle, plus p&p if necessary (ie unless you live relatively local to the Blackburn/Burnley area) - I buy it trade direct from Millers, as I've mentioned on the list before. If anyone wants any, contact me off-list at althamauto@cwcom.net and I'll sort it. Depending on your local prices, it works out slightly cheaper using unleaded plus VSP compared to LRP, and the octane is boosted to 98 - slightly better than most old 4*.